Taylor Swift is the current biggest name in pop BUT does she actually have anything iconic?

[Talkdirty]

What a strange thing to say. Taylor Swift is the biggest pop act in the world, is significantly bigger than Britney ever was or will be. Britney did not fill the stadiums Taylor is filling this long into her career. Taylor is a billionaire. Britney never reached that level of success. The only one to rival Taylor swift is Madonna in terms of success. Followed by Beyoncé.  Taylor swift also has had a bigger cultural impact than Britney. Are y’all okay? Taylor points a finger  and millions of teen girls line up to watch a football game 😂 after the NFL spent millions and failed trying to grow its female audience. Ps: I don’t listen to Taylor swift’s music. Personally I find it boring and I find her insufferable but I at least can separate my feelings from facts 

[i sometimes sing live]

The delusion in this thread... And you don't need to dance like Brit to be a great performer (which Taylor, in fact, is).

[jamesedward94]

22 minutes ago, i sometimes sing live said:

The delusion in this thread... And you don't need to dance like Brit to be a great performer (which Taylor, in fact, is).

No one said she is a bad performer. Just questioning what she has done that is iconic and memorable. People can’t seem to separate “success” from “iconic”. Two different things. She is a great entertainer.

[rik]

4 minutes ago, jamesedward94 said:

No one said she is a bad performer. Just questioning what she

Well I am 

28 minutes ago, i sometimes sing live said:

The delusion in this thread... And you don't need to dance like Brit to be a great performer (which Taylor, in fact, is).

 

[jamesedward94]

41 minutes ago, Talkdirty said:

What a strange thing to say. Taylor Swift is the biggest pop act in the world, is significantly bigger than Britney ever was or will be. Britney did not fill the stadiums Taylor is filling this long into her career. Taylor is a billionaire. Britney never reached that level of success. The only one to rival Taylor swift is Madonna in terms of success. Followed by Beyoncé.  Taylor swift also has had a bigger cultural impact than Britney. Are y’all okay? Taylor points a finger  and millions of teen girls line up to watch a football game 😂 after the NFL spent millions and failed trying to grow its female audience. Ps: I don’t listen to Taylor swift’s music. Personally I find it boring and I find her insufferable but I at least can separate my feelings from facts 

I think their success is very different based on many different factors...

Britney has two diamond albums and everything sold during her biggest days was from pure album sales. Streaming wasn’t even a thing. 
 

Britney could not leave her residence without a swarm of paparazzi unlike anything ever seen before or since. She was the most googled celebrity for many years and is one of the most photographed women of all time.
 

At this point most people know what her family did to her. She most definitely could have and would have sold out stadiums.
 

You CANNOT compare Britney to Taylor’s amount of current success. Things would be VERY different if Britney’s lousy family hadn’t ruined her career. 

And SO early in Britney’s career she was called the princess of pop and had collaborated with both Michael Jackson and Madonna. Taylor has had incredible crazy success, but trying to say she is bigger than Britney is unfair. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by jamesedward94

[MikeHunt]

“I wasn’t good. I was great!”- Taylor on her Eras Tour (2023)

[Talkdirty]

12 minutes ago, jamesedward94 said:

I think their success is very different based on many different factors...

Britney has two diamond albums and everything sold during her biggest days was from pure album sales. Streaming wasn’t even a thing. 
 

Britney could not leave her residence without a swarm of paparazzi unlike anything ever seen before or since. She was the most googled celebrity for many years and is one of the most photographed women of all time.
 

At this point most people know what her family did to her. She most definitely could have and would have sold out stadiums.
 

You CANNOT compare Britney to Taylor’s amount of current success. Things would be VERY different if Britney’s lousy family hadn’t ruined her career. 

And SO early in Britney’s career she was called the princess of pop and had collaborated with both Michael Jackson and Madonna. Taylor has had incredible crazy success, but trying to say she is bigger than Britney is unfair. 

Taylor also has 2 diamond albums. Taylor literally grossed $780 million for The Eras Tour. Britney’s biggest tour grossed $140 million. It’s not even in the same universe 

[BUWYGF]

I enjoy a lot of her songs and I genuinely respect she writes her own material, and her move to re-record her music is absolutely amazing, I applaud her.

But is she iconic? IMO, not really. 

[jamesedward94]

8 minutes ago, Talkdirty said:

Taylor also has 2 diamond albums. Taylor literally grossed $780 million for The Eras Tour. Britney’s biggest tour grossed $140 million. It’s not even in the same universe 

Taylor Swift does not have diamond albums from pure sales only. And again, you cannot compare Taylor’s touring to Britney’s. Britney reached her peak less than a decade into her career and declined only bc of the abuse from her family. If not for what happened with everything, she likely would have remained just as huge and probably would have largely surpassed where she had been.  

[Wendy Williams]

2 hours ago, jamesedward94 said:

Do you understand the word “iconic”?

Not saying she hasn’t been successful bc obviously she has.

How are those music videos iconic?? What is memorable and stands out? There is nothing in those videos that people will remember in years time. I can barely remember much about them. 
 

With Britney we have the school-girl uniform, the Oops! catsuit, the Slave outfit and snake, the Toxic flight attendance….also all of the choreography. Things people STILL replicate and dress up as 20+ years later.

Taylor’s music videos are good but NOT iconic in my opinion…

Amen 

She is successful BUT NOT ICONIC. She was ICONIC in Love Story, You Belong With Me, Back To December, I Bet You Think About Me videos because they were funny, emotional, interesting, original and not thirsty for attention

[Wendy Williams]

7 hours ago, l2hnastatudnainealsoL said:

Taylor just always has something i need to get....... i love learning singing songs with Taylor Swift!

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Whitney Houston

[Wendy Williams]

@princessmimi

I-

 

 

 

 

[i sometimes sing live]

27 minutes ago, jamesedward94 said:

Taylor Swift does not have diamond albums from pure sales only. And again, you cannot compare Taylor’s touring to Britney’s. Britney reached her peak less than a decade into her career and declined only bc of the abuse from her family. If not for what happened with everything, she likely would have remained just as huge and probably would have largely surpassed where she had been.  

You're acting like streaming/digital sales make getting Diamond certified albums easier, but that simply isn't the case. Taylor and Adele are literally the only modern artists to have Diamond certified albums, and that is super impressive:

If anything, it's just as, if not more, impressive considering people buy physical media so much less. And no one knows how Brit's career would've turned out, but what we do know is that Taylor has been huge for like 15 years now, and every time people said she'd had a "flop" era, she came back bigger than ever. She's literally had like 3 career peaks, and that is almost unprecedented unless you're one of the greats.

If you can use the "but times are different now" argument, I can do it too. Back then, everyone was glued to the same TV screens and radio stations, so, of course, it was easier to go down in history with iconic moments. These days, people can pick and choose what content they want to consume. If I were to look at the Billboard Hot 100, I'd probably recognize like 5 songs, which should tell you something - we all live in our own bubble, and there is no monoculture anymore. For this reason, it's borderline impossible to become a Britney/Madonna/Michael kind of megastar in 2023, so the fact alone that Taylor is one of the few to have come close speaks for itself. She is a legend whether you like it or not.

Edited November 15, 2023 by i sometimes sing live

[Martian_M00d]

I'm not a gigantic fan, but not calling her iconic at all is a bit baffling. I feel like Swfities alone need a sociologist and documentary to analyze. She's a borderline religion. And her records, Eras tour, Folklore double album, etc. She's certainly an icon 

[jamesedward94]

7 minutes ago, i sometimes sing live said:

You're acting like streaming/digital sales make getting Diamond certified albums easier, but that simply isn't the case. Taylor and Adele are literally the only modern artists to have Diamond certified albums, and that is super impressive:

If anything, it's just as, if not more, impressive considering people buy physical media so much less. And no one knows how Brit's career would've turned out, but what we do know is that Taylor has been huge for like 15 years now, and every time people said she'd had a "flop" era, she came back bigger than ever. She's literally had like 3 career peaks, and that is almost unprecedented unless you're one of the greats.

If you can use the "but times are different now" argument, I can do it too. Back then, everyone was glued to the same TV screens and radio stations, so, of course, it was easier to go down in history with iconic moments. These days, people can pick and choose what content they want to consume. If I were to look at the Billboard Hot 100, I'd probably recognize like 5 songs, which should tell you something - we all live in our own bubble, and there is no monoculture anymore. For this reason, it's borderline impossible to become a Britney/Madonna/Michael kind of megastar in 2023, so the fact alone that Taylor is one of the few to have come close speaks for itself. She is a legend whether you like it or not.

Okay, well that still only explains her success but doesn’t prove she is iconic. I still believe Britney’s level of fame at her peak was higher than Taylor’s and I stand by that. Britney is the princess of pop for a reason, not Taylor. 

[jamesedward94]

7 minutes ago, Martian_M00d said:

I'm not a gigantic fan, but not calling her iconic at all is a bit baffling. I feel like Swfities alone need a sociologist and documentary to analyze. She's a borderline religion. And her records, Eras tour, Folklore double album, etc. She's certainly an icon 

What has she done that compares to the levels of Britney or Madonna’s iconic moments? Name something of Taylor’s that will be remembered and replicated more than two decades later. Her success is unmatched in many ways, yes. But “iconic” moments? I don’t see them. 
 

I also believe there is a difference between being and “icon” and having “iconic moments”. She IS an icon, but that is different to me. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by jamesedward94

[Martian_M00d]

1 minute ago, jamesedward94 said:

What has she done that compares to the levels of Britney or Madonna’s iconic moments? Name something of Taylor’s that will be remembered and replicated more than two decades later. Her success is unmatched in many ways, yes. But “iconic”? I don’t see it. 
 

I also believe there is a difference between being and “icon” and having “iconic” moments. She IS an icon, but that is different to me. 

I mean it depends on what you define as a moment. Is it only pertaining to on stage events that were televised? Music videos? I think all the music videos people mentioned deserve that. The whole Taylor/Kanye debacle and everything surrounding it; The gigantic behemoth known as The Eras tour. Winning her lawsuit for $1.   If we just mean any moments, then those should count. 

[Martian_M00d]

I think the current media landscape shifts focus on what should be considered an "iconic moment" Television is not king anymore; It's social media, streaming videos and services. 

[jamesedward94]

9 minutes ago, Martian_M00d said:

I mean it depends on what you define as a moment. Is it only pertaining to on stage events that were televised? Music videos? I think all the music videos people mentioned deserve that. The whole Taylor/Kanye debacle and everything surrounding it; The gigantic behemoth known as The Eras tour. Winning her lawsuit for $1.   If we just mean any moments, then those should count. 

Ehh… More so music videos and performances. Like how Britney has specific costumes and choreography that people remember and replicate to this day. And specific performances that are ranked as some of the best of all time. Not saying Taylor’s videos aren’t great. I just don’t think of any certain one as something people would specifically remember and care about two decades later. People just usually mention her overall touring success and streaming numbers and chart achievements. It’s less about the rest.  
 

Can you name a Taylor performance on the level of Britney’s Slave 4 U performance with the snake or Madonna’s Vogue performance as Marie Antoinette? I can’t. 

Edited November 15, 2023 by jamesedward94

[Estrella]

Well, I have read the entire thread, and the main question still has not been answered xd.

There is a latin producer, who has a youtube video that says "why music from the past ages more gracefully." This is like a summary of  the video 

"In the past, you used to hear a hit on the radio or see it on television. Since you didn't know who sang it, you had to call the radio to find out, and if you already knew, you could call again and request it. Once a song became a hit on the radio, you started hearing it everywhere until you bought the physical album or recorded it on cassette, and you would repeat that song until you couldn't anymore. The whole process consumed your money, time, and effort.

Today, the path to success for a song is completely different. Now, on Thursday, they play 15 seconds of the video, and on Friday, they release it. You watch the full video on YouTube, add it to your Spotify playlist, or download it to your phone, and you listen to it as many times as you want. We don't care anymore about what the radio does with that song. So, the release of new music has shifted from the artist to the audience, and just as its beginning was fast, so is its end. In three months, you don't want to hear it anymore because there are 23 new songs. If you listen to old songs,  they have become timeless. These are songs that are not produced as commonly now, so they don't burn out as quickly" 

This producer has make a valid point.

The Beatles, Michael Jackson, Madonna, Freddy Mercury, Britney, etc , they all have iconic  songs, videos an presentation, they are part of pop culture.

If we are going to start calling legends an artist, just because they have sold out tours, then Bad Bunny  could be considered one, his last tour sell around 575 000 tickets in his america leg, for a latin artist that is impressive.The World's Hottest Tour was the third highest-grossing tour of 2022, with earnings of over $314 million dollars for the year's 43 shows and around 1.9 million ticket sales. It thus became the highest-grossing tour in history by a Latin American act. So is he iconic too?

I don´t think so, just because he was able to sell so many songs, albums or a sold out tour, that does not make an artist a legend or iconic, in my opinion.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Estrella