More court stuff - different angle

[Steel Magnolia]

The first time the conservatorship (aka "hybrid business model") is mentioned is on January 28, 2008.

It came in the form of a letter from lawyer Jon Eardley, who had been recruited through Sam Lutfi.

Page 4:

"What they ultimately want is to get you into a conservatorship."

Would it be fair to say that he learned this information directly from Lutfi? (I would think so.)

So how did Lutfi first hear of this news?

[Ghoulia]

1 hour ago, Steel Magnolia said:

When was the first time they connected a threat with the "hybrid business model"?

Who might have this key piece of information?

Other than...Sam Lutfi? 

What would this look like?  An email? Testimony/court transcript? It seems like Larry's testimony in 07 shows that the team was using her children as bait in order for her to follow directions.  

 

Edit:  nevermind, I see your comment about Eardley's letter.  

[Steel Magnolia]

21 minutes ago, Ghoulia said:

What would this look like?  An email? Testimony/court transcript? It seems like Larry's testimony in 07 shows that the team was using her children as bait in order for her to follow directions.  

 

Edit:  nevermind, I see your comment about Eardley's letter.  

I suspect that Lutfi's knowledge of this is what he's been holding over their heads all of these years.

He was able to negotiate the terms of his own restraining order with lawyer Blair Berk...Who gets to negotiate the terms of their own restraining order?! Unless there is a quid pro quo of some sort going on?

As far as connecting a threat with the conservatorship...

I'm thinking the idea originally came from Lou M. Taylor...Who more than likely talked it over first with Lynne Spears.

According to Britney, the idea came from Lynne, so this "fits" the scenario that I had already suspected had occurred.

But...

An idea is just an idea until it is put on paper.

I'm thinking the wheels had to be put in motion at some point during 2007 via conference calls or emails or text messages...There were a number of players that had to be brought on board. The Luce Forward lawyers, Andrew Wallet, Kevin Federline...And I highly doubt it occurred merely weeks before the second 5150, as Lynne implies in her book.

So who might have a copy of those emails or text messages? 

P.S. If Larry Rudolph was organizing the conference calls regarding the intervention in February of 2007...Was he still the same person organizing it all in the months to follow? Or did he step back once Britney fired him in April of 2007? My guess is that, as a lawyer, he would know enough to step back so as not to dirty his hands legally...And that someone else was likely doing the organizing for the planning of the conservatorship itself.

[Ghoulia]

39 minutes ago, Steel Magnolia said:

I suspect that Lutfi's knowledge of this is what he's been holding over their heads all of these years.

He was able to negotiate the terms of his own restraining order with lawyer Blair Berk...Who gets to negotiate the terms of their own restraining order?! Unless there is a quid pro quo of some sort going on?

As far as connecting a threat with the conservatorship...

I'm thinking the idea originally came from Lou M. Taylor...Who more than likely talked it over first with Lynne Spears.

According to Britney, the idea came from Lynne, so this "fits" the scenario that I had already suspected had occurred.

But...

An idea is just an idea until it is put on paper.

I'm thinking the wheels had to be put in motion at some point during 2007 via conference calls or emails or text messages...There were a number of players that had to be brought on board. The Luce Forward lawyers, Andrew Wallet, Kevin Federline...And I highly doubt it occurred merely weeks before the second 5150, as Lynne implies in her book.

So who might have a copy of those emails or text messages? 

P.S. If Larry Rudolph was organizing the conference calls regarding the intervention in February of 2007...Was he still the same person organizing it all in the months to follow? Or did he step back once Britney fired him in April of 2007? My guess is that, as a lawyer, he would know enough to step back so as not to dirty his hands legally...And that someone else was likely doing the organizing for the planning of the conservatorship itself.

Have you ever asked Lutfi about this?  

[Steel Magnolia]

35 minutes ago, Ghoulia said:

Have you ever asked Lutfi about this?  

I haven't.

I honestly don't think there's any motivation for him to tell me the truth if I were to ask.

[B. Leigh]

On 12/30/2021 at 9:00 PM, Steel Magnolia said:

I've never referred to Ingham as "Kingham," but I did compliment him when he did a good job...And there were times when he made smart legal moves. We've actually heard of additional times since then when he advocated for Britney in the early years and spoke out against Team CON's behaviour.

Should he have informed Britney she could terminate? Absolutely...But he wasn't all bad, either. 

We are going to have to agree to disagree lmao...

[B. Leigh]

On 12/31/2021 at 2:28 PM, Steel Magnolia said:

Page 4:

"What they ultimately want is to get you into a conservatorship."

Would it be fair to say that he learned this information directly from Lutfi? (I would think so.)

So how did Lutfi first hear of this news?

I always felt that Lutfi was always apart of the initial set up and plan for the conservatorship but then got yeeted out when Jamie entered the picture...

[Steel Magnolia]

1 hour ago, B. Leigh said:

We are going to have to agree to disagree lmao...

Oh, I know my feelings towards Ingham aren't popular on here!

But he did get a few good legal jabs in at Jamie leading up to Britney's June testimony, as well as advocate for her going back as far as 2012...And that's what we've seen from the documents that have been leaked so far.

The problem with Ingham is that he broke laws while helping to create the temporary conservatorship in 2008...And from that moment onwards, the rest of Team CON had something they could hold over his head. 

He couldn't do much, even if he wanted to...So he just kept on collecting those paycheques, while doing the bare minimum. If that.

[Steel Magnolia]

1 hour ago, B. Leigh said:

I always felt that Lutfi was always apart of the initial set up and plan for the conservatorship but then got yeeted out when Jamie entered the picture...

I think you're 100% right about that.

Not only was he present for the first and second 5150's, but Lynne has placed him on the scene prior to Britney's third trip to rehab in February of 2007.

I think Lutfi thought he was going to be a part of it all once the conservatorship had been created...But received a rude awakening when they filed for the restraining order.

[B. Leigh]

1 hour ago, Steel Magnolia said:

I think you're 100% right about that.

Not only was he present for the first and second 5150's, but Lynne has placed him on the scene prior to Britney's third trip to rehab in February of 2007.

I think Lutfi thought he was going to be a part of it all once the conservatorship had been created...But received a rude awakening when they filed for the restraining order.

Which is also why he and Lynn have such a weird dynamic...like they hate eachother but can't say too much because they have shared secrets...

[B. Leigh]

1 hour ago, Steel Magnolia said:

as well as advocate for her going back as far as 2012..

How was he an advocate in 2012?

[Steel Magnolia]

51 minutes ago, B. Leigh said:

How was he an advocate in 2012?

Let me get back to you on that one.

I've used up my allotted number of NY Times articles for the month and I suspect it may have been in one of those...Perhaps the one from 2016?

When I find it, I'll post it...I just remember seeing it and thinking, "I'm going to use this the next time someone gives me a hard time for my opinion of Ingham." 

[RebellionSparkles]

6 hours ago, B. Leigh said:

I always felt that Lutfi was always apart of the initial set up and plan for the conservatorship but then got yeeted out when Jamie entered the picture...

I completely agree 😁

I think Sam L was a part of the initial set up with Lynne, but then he played both sides and told B about the conservatorship plot…essentially, Sam L is only relevant early in the story. 
…I get the vibe that Sam L is essentially the **** hookup guy for celebs…a **** broker (connects celebs with **** dealers)…not a big deal but at the same time has an important role in the celeb club community. 
 

[BritneyIsFinallyFree]

Why is there still suspicion on Sam? This court transcript proved all of Lynne’s allegations about him were false per her own admission, AND that Sam argued Britney should be presumed competent to testify, which sounds like an attempt to get her the **** out of the conservatorship. 
 

https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=15255866402745588563&q=related:U5t3DKq5t9MJ:scholar.google.com/&hl=en&as_sdt=6,44

[BritneyIsFinallyFree]

Even more damning for Lynne and fully exonerates Sam, since he not only won the suit re false allegations in her book, but also had numerous witnesses denying Lynne's claims:

 https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=1954026904044652984&q=britney+spears&hl=en&as_sdt=4,5

"Lutfi also filed declarations of four third-party witnesses. Robin Johnson was a "Supervised Visitation Monitor" who had been hired by Britney's attorneys to monitor, witness and report on Britney's interaction with her two children.

Johnson attested to the falsity of Spears's statements that Lutfi cut Britney's phone wires, disabled Britney's automobiles, and attempted to **** Britney into a coma.

 Alli Sims was a personal assistant to Britney, who was residing at Britney's home between February 2007 and October 2007, and thereafter was in contact with Britney nearly every day. Sims also negated Spears's statements that Lutfi had disabled cell phones, the home phones, or automobiles.

Adnan, who was Britney's boyfriend during the relevant time period, also declared that Spears's assertions regarding disabling the telephones were false. In addition, based on his personal knowledge, Adnan asserted his disbelief of Spears's statement that Lutfi was grinding up pills and putting them in Britney's food.

Finally, Felipe Teixeira, a photographer who visited Britney's home and drove around town with her, also refuted Spears's claim that Lutfi cut telephone wires and disabled Britney's cars."

The court doc also points out the obvious: if Sam was guilty of that which he was accused, he'd have been charged. What's sick is Lynne's RO was used as a basis for the conservatorship, specifically because they stated Britney was being stalked by Sam and was unable to resist the influence he specifically had on her. When her statements were proven/admitted as false, the entire "rationale" for the conservatorship to begin with also dissipated.

It's also notable that everything Lynne accuses Sam of doing (e.g., taking away her phones, forcibly medicating her, not letting her leave, socially isolating her, calling her a bad mom and *****, etc), ARE ALL THINGS WE NOW KNOW JAMIE EXPLICITLY DID. She just listed off her own ******* husbands behavior and substituted "Jamie" with "Sam." It's so sick. 

[BritneyIsFinallyFree]

Oh, and considering Sam was joining Eardley in stating the conservatorship was an abuse of power and should be dissolved, I can't imagine he was benefiting from it.

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/britney-spears-cries-for-help-lead-to-three-year-restraining-orders-for-ex-manager-lawyer-103538/

“'Never before in the history of the world has a restraining order been issued against someone who merely responded to cries for help,'” Lutfi’s lawyer Bryan Freedman said. Spears’ attorney Joel Boxer admitted that the restraining order request was 'unusual,' but argued it was necessary in order to protect the Cirus singer from 'people who I think are fairly characterized as predators.' Lutfi and Eardley both posited that the conservatorship is a misuse of power, as it normally only applies to people mentally incapable of making their own decisions; as Britney is currently on tour performing to thousands on a nightly basis, she therefore seems competent enough to speak on her own behalf."

[RebellionSparkles]

On 1/1/2022 at 11:41 PM, BritneyIsFinallyFree said:

Why is there still suspicion on Sam? This court transcript proved all of Lynne’s allegations about him were false per her own admission, AND that Sam argued Britney should be presumed competent to testify, which sounds like an attempt to get her the **** out of the conservatorship. 
 

https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=15255866402745588563&q=related:U5t3DKq5t9MJ:scholar.google.com/&hl=en&as_sdt=6,44

Everyone pretty much has to assume the worst about Lufti unless a reasonable narrative arises about his role. There’s involvement with Blair Berk in 2008, mentions of “SL matter” in 2019 conservatorship accounting, continued involvement with Lynne. Where there is smoke there is fire. 

It’s been well established that what Lynne said in her book is not true. But why do you think that means SL is completely not involved?

Sam Lufti:

[Tar_isa]

4 hours ago, BritneyIsFinallyFree said:

Even more damning for Lynne and fully exonerates Sam, since he not only won the suit re false allegations in her book, but also had numerous witnesses denying Lynne's claims:

 https://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=1954026904044652984&q=britney+spears&hl=en&as_sdt=4,5

"Lutfi also filed declarations of four third-party witnesses. Robin Johnson was a "Supervised Visitation Monitor" who had been hired by Britney's attorneys to monitor, witness and report on Britney's interaction with her two children.

Johnson attested to the falsity of Spears's statements that Lutfi cut Britney's phone wires, disabled Britney's automobiles, and attempted to **** Britney into a coma.

 Alli Sims was a personal assistant to Britney, who was residing at Britney's home between February 2007 and October 2007, and thereafter was in contact with Britney nearly every day. Sims also negated Spears's statements that Lutfi had disabled cell phones, the home phones, or automobiles.

Adnan, who was Britney's boyfriend during the relevant time period, also declared that Spears's assertions regarding disabling the telephones were false. In addition, based on his personal knowledge, Adnan asserted his disbelief of Spears's statement that Lutfi was grinding up pills and putting them in Britney's food.

Finally, Felipe Teixeira, a photographer who visited Britney's home and drove around town with her, also refuted Spears's claim that Lutfi cut telephone wires and disabled Britney's cars."

The court doc also points out the obvious: if Sam was guilty of that which he was accused, he'd have been charged. What's sick is Lynne's RO was used as a basis for the conservatorship, specifically because they stated Britney was being stalked by Sam and was unable to resist the influence he specifically had on her. When her statements were proven/admitted as false, the entire "rationale" for the conservatorship to begin with also dissipated.

It's also notable that everything Lynne accuses Sam of doing (e.g., taking away her phones, forcibly medicating her, not letting her leave, socially isolating her, calling her a bad mom and *****, etc), ARE ALL THINGS WE NOW KNOW JAMIE EXPLICITLY DID. She just listed off her own ******* husbands behavior and substituted "Jamie" with "Sam." It's so sick. 

Yeah, those things used to get the RO are lies, but that only means they tried hard to kick him out of Britney's life at that point in time, it doesn't mean, at all, that he wasn't bad news or that he wasn't involved or somehow in the know of what was happening. His involvement pre-conservatorship, his presence in other famous celebrities' "low moments", his weird dynamic with Lynne... it all just smells too much.

Being right about some things and being fu**ed over by evil people, is not the same as being a good guy.

[Bambas]

5 hours ago, Tar_isa said:

Yeah, those things used to get the RO are lies, but that only means they tried hard to kick him out of Britney's life at that point in time, it doesn't mean, at all, that he wasn't bad news or that he wasn't involved or somehow in the know of what was happening. His involvement pre-conservatorship, his presence in other famous celebrities' "low moments", his weird dynamic with Lynne... it all just smells too much.

Being right about some things and being fu**ed over by evil people, is not the same as being a good guy.

Exactly. Because one is bad it doesn't mean the other one is good.

 

[RebellionSparkles]

Hey - anyone following this thread, I posted a new thread you will probably find interesting: "Accounting review - Twelfth Account Current."

I reviewed Brit's accounting filings today and uploaded an annotated version of the Twelfth Account Current--covers 2019 in the conservatorship. Any of your insights are v welcomed.